r/PublicFreakout Sep 22 '22 Silver 4 Helpful 4 Wholesome 7 Take My Energy 1 Rocket Like 1

Trumpist Curses at KKK members (context i found on original video)

46.6k Upvotes

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5.0k

u/parkerm1408 Sep 22 '22

Human version of an angry upvote I guess. Like...I hate what you stand for but I guess we can agree the kkk suck more.

2.7k

u/qasimq Sep 22 '22

Yup. Disagree with Trump and his base on everything. But if they are going to stand up against KKK I'm in agreement there.

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u/Buffphan Sep 22 '22

It’s One guy. Let’s not start crowning Trump as the champion of civil right yet

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u/Ok_Contribution_8817 Sep 22 '22 Silver Helpful Wholesome Narwhal Salute Got the W Eureka!

“You racists make Us fascists look bad”

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u/fusillade762 Sep 22 '22

Yeah he doesn't seem to have a problem with their beliefs, just the optics. Am I reading that wrong? I guess this is better than running over to give em a hug lol.

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u/XxRocky88xX Sep 22 '22

It’s like what Stormfront says in Boys: “People like what I have to say. They believe in it. They just don’t like the word Nazi, that’s all.”

These people agree with what the KKK stands for, but since the acronym “KKK” has some seriously negative connotations to it, they hate the KKK, not because they disagree with anything the KKK does, but because their mind associates KKK with evil.

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u/ChrisDoom Sep 22 '22 edited Sep 23 '22

Damn, there are really people trying to tell you this isn’t an accurate read on the situation. As statements in a vacuum we agree racism, Nazis, and the KKK are bad but then you see people who don’t seem to actually understand WHY those things are all bad and the condemnation from them is just hollow. From there it can go one of two ways, either they realize their beliefs align with those things and lean in and start openly claiming it or they realize their beliefs aligns with those things and they reevaluate those beliefs.

Although the fact that this guy is wearing an American flag Punisher logo shirt does make me think that he’s not the deep thinking reflective type.

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u/phantom_hope Sep 22 '22

Same with a lot of right-wing germans here in Germany (duh). They hate to be called Nazis even tho they advocate for a fascist regime and the deportation of every single muslim.

They just don't want to be called Nazi, they have no problem spitting fascist and racist arguments.

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u/Zmchastain Sep 22 '22

I’m not sure they even necessarily hate the KKK so much as they hate the optics of being openly associated with them.

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u/music3k Sep 22 '22

Theyre told by their propaganda that the KKK are actually Democrats. Its the same problem of them not understanding the parties flipped, or that Trump doesnt give a shit about religion or anything besides himself

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u/Zmchastain Sep 22 '22

Honestly, the history and labels are much less important than recognizing that if you share significant overlap in your political views with the klan that you might be the bad guys.

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u/Gary-Fuckin-Oak Sep 22 '22

See, that requires self awareness, which is sorely lacking in these clowns.

There’s a reason why r/SelfAwarewolves exists, and it sure as hell isn’t because any significant number of these people can look in the mirror and self reflect honestly.

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u/music3k Sep 22 '22

They dont care if theyre the bad guys, because a book they dont read supposedly tells them its okay.

See: abortions. The Bible literally explains how to perform an abortion, but these numbnuts are against it

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u/surfnporn Sep 22 '22

You guys are jumping so many mental hurdles just to make the guy clearly berating and hating the KKK as not being so. Don't try so hard, buddy.

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u/XxRocky88xX Sep 22 '22

I mean if you actually have a problem with the KKK’s philosophy you wouldn’t be part of MAGA since they’re 99% identical in their philosophies

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u/surfnporn Sep 22 '22 edited Sep 22 '22

I'm going to assume you're white because you clearly have no idea how many non-white MAGA idiots there are.

edit: Clearly a lot of Redditors are too busy foaming at the mouth to process any logical arguments, so I'm going to stop responding to the children here.

https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2018/08/09/an-examination-of-the-2016-electorate-based-on-validated-voters/

28% of hispanic and 14% of black-male voters agree with the KKK by your argument. Good job morons.

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u/[deleted] Sep 22 '22

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u/Zmchastain Sep 22 '22

No. There are no hurdles to jump. All this guy has said is that they’re making them look bad. He isn’t telling them their views are bad.

It’s entirely possible that he only has a problem with the robes, not the views they represent. After all, the alt-right movement was an effort to rebrand literal nazism in a more presentable package. They weren’t changing the views, just how it’s presented.

It’s not jumping hurdles when we all know that the fascists are well aware that they have an image/PR problem and don’t want to associate themselves with old symbols that have strong negative connotations, like swastikas and klan robes.

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u/surfnporn Sep 22 '22

I think the guy saying "if the cops weren't here I'd fight every one of you right now" just hates the KKK, not the optics.

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u/fusillade762 Sep 22 '22

In fairness after rewatching he does mention white supremacy though I couldnt entirely make out what he said. I would guess he doesnt favor it. At least openly. The other guy seemed to be shouting youre racists. I do take issue with claims of being "real americans". These guys are monarchists who do not support democratic ideas unless they favor their favored monarch or viewpoint Thats pretty much the opposite of American ideals or what this country was founded on. Im glad he doesnt like the kkk but these guys are still asshats.

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u/surfnporn Sep 22 '22

Agreed, I really do strongly despise Trump supporters.

That said, the amount of people in this thread that can't fathom "Not all Trump supporters like the KKK" is excruciatingly painful. It's the idiots like think like that which make it increasingly difficult to associate with the left.

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u/FriedEggScrambled Sep 23 '22

“Make America Great Again” is literally a KKK slogan. It was/is on numerous leaflets and pamphlets.

Maybe don’t defend someone who’s supporting fascism just because they were seen on video, all while not understanding that the person they’re yelling at, are the ones who understand the actual dog whistles.

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u/getthephenom Sep 22 '22

This was the exact thought that came to my mind.

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u/ignatiusjreillyreak Sep 22 '22

He is fighting the racists on camera in public, we can at least give him a little slack. It takes a lot to state you are not racist and also fight racists in public like that of you are a racist.

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u/Shovels93 Sep 22 '22

What part do they agree with exactly?

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u/XxRocky88xX Sep 22 '22

That people of color are ruining the country and the only way to save is to do mass deportations and shut down borders so no more immigrants can get in

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u/Poopiepants29 Sep 22 '22

Some of them, maybe. Or like, from all of my experience with them, it's just that they've been convinced that they hate "liberals"... And Trump and conservatives are the cure to them and their agendas. Not really anything to do with race, for the majority, but go and paint that broad reddit upvotey brush.

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u/XxRocky88xX Sep 22 '22 edited Sep 22 '22

“Mexico is sending us drug dealers and rapists”

“We need to build a wall to keep immigrants out”

Yeah. Absolutely nothing to do with race

And if they don’t agree with that, but they still vote for Trump anyway and all the homophobic, transphobic, racist, misogynistic shit that comes with it just for the sake of “owning the libs.” That makes it even worse, because that means you’re voting for things you know are fucked up and don’t even believe it all in an attempt to upset someone.

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u/Shovels93 Sep 22 '22

That’s a wild misrepresentation of the actual argument .

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u/No-comment-at-all Sep 22 '22 edited Sep 22 '22

Well, what’s the actual argument?

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u/reddit4getit Sep 22 '22

These people agree with what the KKK stands for,

They clearly don't.

It won't kill you to have some common ground with people you disagree with.

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u/IPDDoE Sep 22 '22

It's honestly not a large leap...

*White protestant Christian, check

*"law and order," check

*curbing immigration, check

*"saving America" from the dirties, check

*Great Replacement Theory, check

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u/reddit4getit Sep 22 '22

Your characterizations are equally nonsensical.

Plenty of non white, non Christians love President Trump, what box are you going to place them in to make your ridiculous comparisons?

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u/IPDDoE Sep 22 '22

I'd say it's probably likely that they agree with at least a few of the ideas listed, otherwise they wouldn't have voted for him, because he certainly didn't stand for much else as president. Then there's the fact that your originally commented that "these people" don't agree with the KKK, not literally everyone who voted for trump. But considering this guy is white, is wearing a symbol that the morons have unironically adopted as representing the "law and order" meme I referenced, and the fact that trump himself and or his most vocal supporters have both hinted at and outright said all the things I listed, it seems like you're doing whatever you can to mischaracterize my point to make yourself appear right.

Fun fact, you're the first person I tagged who then showed back up in my inbox with exactly the same type of comments for which I tagged you in the first place.

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u/FriedEggScrambled Sep 23 '22

I don’t understand why you choose to die on the hill you’re standing on.

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u/engi_nerd Sep 22 '22

Quite the mental gymnastics you have there.

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u/XxRocky88xX Sep 22 '22 edited Sep 22 '22

“Stop thinking about it logically. The guy who hates people of color said “fuck you” to someone else who hates people of color. Therefore he doesn’t hate people of color.

He will prove this by voting to strip the rights from people of color in 2024”

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u/engi_nerd Sep 22 '22

Lmao ok bud 🤡

-5

u/Just_Jer Sep 22 '22

I know you guys love to make your little points, but you DO realize Joe Biden spoke at the funeral of a KKK member, right? Look up Robert Byrd. But you didn't vote for him, right? You're one of the GOOD Democrats...

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u/Synectics Sep 22 '22 edited Sep 22 '22

KKK member

Former KKK member who left it in the 1940's.

The guy was hardly a wonderful person, but come on. You're purposely leaving out details for your agenda.

He had a crazy story. It's not nefarious for notable Democrats to speak at the funeral of someone who ran in the Presidential election as a Democrat in the 1960's.

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u/Just_Jer Sep 22 '22

YOU'RE leaving out the fact that if something happened in someone's past, people are only too happy to cancel them. That wasn't Biden's only racial issue, just ask Kamala Harris. And he wasn't just a member, he formed his own group of 140 members.

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u/YawnDogg Sep 23 '22

Please don’t insult me. It’s “The Boys” thank you very much

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u/XxRocky88xX Sep 23 '22

Personally I think just “The” suffices but no one seems to know what the fuck I’m talking about

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u/DreamedJewel58 Sep 22 '22

Yup, exactly. Almost any time you see right-wingers argue about the KKK, it’s almost always just “they make us look bad!” instead of actually talking about their generational influence on modern day Republican politics and trying to separate the two

They’re essentially saying “we’re fine with you, just take the hood off and stop giving us bad optics!”

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u/fusillade762 Sep 22 '22

To be fair, after watching it again he does mention white supremacy, I just cant make out what hes saying but I dont think it was voicing support. Not openly. How much of this is performative is probably 100% but I dont know whats in this mans heart. Other than he supports an orange fascist scumbag who attracts love and admiration from the KKK and neo nazis. So thats not great.

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u/FigNugginGavelPop Sep 22 '22

There’s a willfully ignorant group, willfully evil group, plain ignorant group in the Trumper tent. I think this guy is in the willfully ignorant group, while he realizes certain aspects about racism are really bad, especially for optics, they will say that they are bad, then they pick and choose the parts of racism that are most convenient to them personally, while those aspects overlap with KKK beliefs they aren’t bad because he and his peers believe them. It’s just like how they cherry-pick what works for them from the bible. It’s just always self-serving. They really deserve their leader.

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u/MKclinch8 Sep 22 '22

Guy is just wearing a different version of an asshole’s uniform

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u/getthephenom Sep 22 '22

They stand for the same thing. Just don't like saying KKK.

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u/[deleted] Sep 22 '22

[deleted]

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u/dasher11 Sep 22 '22

The fact that he ends with saying, "You're making white patriotism look bad," confirms for me that he is racist. Maybe you think it's "inferring" because you're used to that kind of casually racist language.

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u/PerfectZeong Sep 22 '22

Yeah because hes white and showing patriotism and he feels that the media makes white people who are patriots out to be white supremacists. Like whatever you may think about what he thinks is patriotism he's not saying that with a racist intent.

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u/Wiggletons Sep 22 '22

Bless your heart

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u/surfnporn Sep 22 '22

He's not wrong. Clearly that guy hates the hate group that hails whites as a superior race, but also has pride in his own heritage and race. Maybe he hates the confederates for being slave owners? Seems like he just wants to be proud of his own heritage without having the racists ruin that for him.

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u/[deleted] Sep 22 '22

If Trump supporters are going to get ridiculed for taking a stand against the KKK, then you can't really expect them to change camps either.

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u/Y_signal2020 Sep 22 '22

The guy straight up says, "you're making us look bad!" It's not about ideology, it's about optics.

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u/[deleted] Sep 22 '22

Okey. Atleast we can agree with this dude that being associated with the KKK looks bad. If we want someone to change their political views I think we got to start from the middle ground.

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u/LukesRightHandMan Sep 22 '22

"Can't we all just get along and punch a Nazi today?"

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u/NewSauerKraus Sep 22 '22

It’s funny because it’s not the klan making maga look bad. It’s the identical ideologies that make them look bad together.

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u/fusillade762 Sep 22 '22

Could be, though I try to keep and open mind. If you read further down the thread I reassess to a degree.

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u/tryingtobecheeky Sep 22 '22

No. He genuinely hates white supremacist. You can be non racist and a fascist.

It's weird and needs a lot of cognitive dissonance but it's possible.

Cause he wants to see people's rights curbed stomped... but equally without targeting POC.

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u/LukesRightHandMan Sep 22 '22

Then who does he want targeted?

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u/tryingtobecheeky Sep 22 '22

I dunno. I'm not in his brain. But he probably has this horrifyingly wrong image of what and who Trump is and is worshipping that false idol.

I had a friend like that. Attended BLM rallies, supported sister's MTF surgeries, accompanied his friends to abortion clinics ... but loves Trump.

He believes Trump is actually pro-choice and cool with the gays and POC but playing the long con. And will save America.

He is legit a bit dumb, especially since we aren't American.

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u/LukesRightHandMan Sep 22 '22

Gotcha. Well in America, we have some gays supporting Trump because he hasn't openly attacked the LGB crowd, just the T's. It's the "I got mine, so fuck you," crowd. Same with racial minorities.

I'm from Miami. He won Florida but the age-old bullshit claim to Cubans that Biden is a Commie. Funny thing, Cubans are granted automatic citizenship when they step one foot on American soil, so a large percentage (I'd say majority), don't give a fuck about the GOP's hateful immigration policies toward other Latin immigrants.

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u/tryingtobecheeky Sep 22 '22

So interesting to see that cognitive dissonance, isn't it?

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u/OneTeslaIsAScam Sep 22 '22

This man still supported our former President attempting a coup after he lost the election. He does not actually give a shit about anyone else but himself. He is a fascist. Whether he hates the worst fascists of the bunch doesn't make him any less of a hateful coward too.

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u/disenchantedoptimist Sep 22 '22

No, I think you're reading it wrong in his and many average Trump voter's cases. I say the following with the caveats that there are obviously real white supremacists and proud bigots in significant numbers who love and support Trump, and there is also prejudice and hate in varying degrees of consciousness among those clearly aren't white supremacists which makes some Trump rhetoric appeal to base "Conservatives".

And I personally hate Trumpism and what he stands for in modern American politics. However he has preyed upon the fears and prejudices of many average conservatives and manipulated those people with lies and misinformation into believing that they are actually fighting for what they see traditional American values/virtues when they are supporting him is actually one of the more pernicious aspects of what he has done to our politics.

Many of the people out at the January 6th events (though clearly not those who planned it and set out with an intent towards violence and insurrection) were there not because they believed that they were undermining or destabilizing the constitutional process and democracy as a whole, but because they were duped and/or brainwashed into believing that what they were doing was actually supporting it, or fighting in favor of it.

Trump did this through lies, misinformation, and old fashioned populist demagoguery as charismatic leader who told them everything good they wanted to hear about themselves, their politics, and their country, as well as everything bad that they felt about their political enemies, playing directly into negative partisanship. And after demonizing mainstream media sources and essentially co-opting much of conservative media, he was able to cut many conservatives off from objective reality, and over time bend theirs toward his, which was only exacerbated by social media whose algorithms filtered out news/information that would not appeal to them while promoting news that would, reinforcing Trump's manufactured reality.

In classical Freudian terms he essentially appealed completely to the Conservative Id (some of which was clearly driven by racial issues, and primal ingroup/outgroup dynamics), while his manipulations and misinformation confused their conscious, deliberative mind (Ego) into believing that what they were supporting was both rational and good as it presented solutions for problems both real and manufactured. And once siloed into an information stream that supported all those conclusions, it allowed them derive all the pleasures of feeding that Id, while believing that they were doing good, which played into that negative partisanship binary of self righteousness in one's own position and demonization of the opposition (or anyone who might present information that contradicts or conflicts with their newly curated reality). So what you are seeing with those true beleivers to whom this analysis applies (like this guy in question, and honestly a significant part of his base) is essentially their Superego kicking in when they see something they can still clearly identify as immoral or wrong like the KKK, Nazis, White Supremacists. And seeing those types of people in association with their own beliefs provokes the same type of response and anger that they have for those who try to break through their brainwashing with facts and properly sourced information, because both threaten their worldview by elevating the contradictions inherent within the toxic framework that they were duped into believing.

This is also why it's nearly impossible for most of these people to turn on Trump, because every time an issue has arisen with him that might potentially break through their brainwashing, they've doubled down, not only because they can't admit they were wrong about him or were duped into following him, but more importantly that to do so would not only shatter the manufactured reality in which they are able to satisfy their unconscious political desires, feel self righteous and morally superior while doing so, and also frames all of their opposition as clear, simple, black-hat enemies, making it only more imperative to fight with whatever means necessary for their cause. So after doubling down again and again, and with a large portion of their identity on the line (along with the ingroup relationships they've cultivated along the way) they are essentially pot commited at this point on Trumpism.

And that is the very specific kind of tragedy of a guy like this, who believes so strongly that what he's doing is good and right, and has the conviction to say so and stand up for his beliefs, but so much of it is based in self-delusion and the lies of a self serving demogogue. This is very likely a guy who loves his country, democracy, the Constitution, and hates racism, white supremacy, and fascism, and I believe is sincere in his anger and words agaisnt the KKK here, but (and it's a large but), that same passion has also been misdirected and corrupted to such an extent that he might also believe those on 1/6 were patriots standing up for what is right, or that interrupting the peaceful transfer of power after a valid election was actually supportive of democracy, or that he's fighting against fascism by supporting Trump, or that he's actually combating racism by opposing the concept of Black Lives Matter the same as he is here calling out the white supremacists.

It's sad.

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u/tjoe4321510 Sep 22 '22

Idk, the other guy seems to be pretty against their racism though.

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u/FigNugginGavelPop Sep 22 '22

You are absolutely right. It’s funny you have less upvotes but not surprising.

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u/ClumpyFelchCheese Sep 23 '22

This guy prefers phantom/calculated racism over blatant/easy-to-callout racism. It makes MAGA look bad AND it’s less effective racism, so he denounces it.

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u/ifeelearthspin Sep 22 '22

Love how a neck beard on Reddit can see a video of a guy condemning racists and somehow still make him out to be racist.

Jfc. You don’t have to like trumpers. But making assumptions of this guy that directly oppose what we see on video is ridiculous.

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u/fusillade762 Sep 23 '22

I'm not a neck beard, I'm a just below my eyeballs beard. ;-D

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u/kittenegg25 Sep 22 '22

Well they DO reference being against KKK beliefs- calling them racist.

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u/[deleted] Sep 22 '22

That’s the problem with us politics everything is black and white and it paints the supporters of both parties as black and white when in reality everything is nuanced and in grey. I think it would be cool to see a USA that has more split parties to see where people really split on nuance and issues

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u/Tessara444 Sep 22 '22

Theocratic fascists . So... Racist, but basing it all in the religion to pretend it's not just as bigoted.

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u/WhiteyFiskk Sep 22 '22

Reminds me of the old south park episode with the racist flag. Nobody wants the KKK to be seen on their side of the argument

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u/Makes_Them_Eat_Honey Sep 22 '22

I’m gonna get downvoted to hell by this but you do know that by calling half the country fascists for having more right wing opinions you’re actually the ones that are putting them on the track to become fascists? You can see it clearly if you go back and watch the news from Reagan and Bush Jr. Y’all (thank god) have no idea what fascism or socialism is in the US.

You want European “socialism” without having ID’s, which is impossible since the ID is the basis to distributing resources from the state. You want open borders without realising that again, a socialism system works when every citizen is contributing and paying taxes or it quickly becomes impossible to sustain it. Abortion laws are the same, I completely agree that abortion should be legal but you used to be able to abort up until something like 26 weeks in some states using Europe as a justification, without realising that no state in Europe allows abortion for more than 18 weeks.

I don’t support anyone because I’m not an American and it’s not my place, but I do worry by seeing people turning so extreme on both sides. Without compromise democracy fails, try to learn from history. If you don’t allow someone to be a conservative they’ll get more radical and eventually turn into the fascists you claim them to be.

Also, yes, I only commented on left leaning problems because I know no conservative is reading this on Reddit. Y’all need to chill, you got a great country, please don’t ruin it cause eventually I want to emigrate over there.

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u/Hunterio009 Sep 22 '22

I know right haha the cognitive dissonance is astounding.

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u/palehorse95 Sep 22 '22

I never understood how the group that wants to shrink the influence of govt, disband entire governmental agencies, and ensure that the civilian population are armed to the teeth against a possible tyrannical turn by the govt, could possibly be fascist?

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u/JolteonJoestar Sep 22 '22

Expansion of police, military, and private-public partnerships :)

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u/Jay_R_Kay Sep 22 '22

I mean, they talk a good talk about shrinking federal government influence, but they hardly walk the walk. They just want to expand the government in the ways that they want.

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u/palehorse95 Sep 22 '22

Let's be honest here. Any fear of a possible authoritarian govt would have to be focused on any person or party that grows the size and/or authority of the federal govt. The recent addition of 87,000 IRS agents, many of which will be armed, does not bode well for the current party in power.

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u/Jerkcules Sep 22 '22 edited Sep 22 '22

What? The 87000 IRS agents are just there to help the wildly understaffed IRS process tax returns. Some of those are enforcement agents, but most are just accountants. And this is after the GOP gutted the IRS in 2011 to benefit the ultra-rich:

https://www.propublica.org/article/how-the-irs-was-gutted

The current spin is that it's an "87,000 strong army", but that's just anti-taxation propaganda pushed by the wealthy and their toy soldiers in Congress. They been trying to destroy the IRS since at least the 90's.

Whenever a politician talks about "small government", look at their donors. 99% of the time they're a mouthpiece for corporations who just wants less regulation/taxation. Those politicians will gladly support more government when it supports their donors' interests. Virtually no politician actually wants less power.

Let's also not ignore that while this crowd claims to be anti-authoritarian, they love police. Given that the police are the general public's main interaction with executive power, I'd hesitate to call them "anti-authoritarian" by any stretch just based on that. Not to mention that the conservative stance on issues like abortion and immigration are pro-big government.

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u/palehorse95 Sep 22 '22

There are 157 million employed americans

That means we will have one IRS agent for every 960 employed Americans.

Only 2.8 million of those earn over Biden's $400K threshold for increased taxes.

The additional 87K agents will mean an additional 1 agent for every 32 Americans earning 400K.

Does that sound like rational numbers to you?

Do we need almost 170,000 tax collectors for a society were the majority of the population pays no taxes and of those that do, the majority file a one page 1040ez form?

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u/LukesRightHandMan Sep 22 '22

My dude, the propaganda will skew numbers like that. I haven't read the specifics, but just going by the numbers presented in this thread by you and others:

A) Not every one of those employees will be an agent. Can you imagine how many employees it takes to create and maintain basic infrastructure for an agency? Not every NASA employee is has a mic and a computer in the Command Center.

B) Even with more accountants, it's not an equal distribution like that. We need this massive increase at the IRS because the wealthy- not just the ultra-wealthy like Bezos- cheat their taxes by loophole after offshore account after loophole. It will take multiple accountants to work through their filings.

Edit: https://time.com/6204928/irs-87000-agents-factcheck-biden/

There’s only one problem. It’s not true.

The Inflation Reduction Act, a landmark climate, health care and tax package that passed the Senate on Sunday and is expected to head to Biden’s desk after the House approves it on Friday, includes roughly $78 billion for the IRS to be phased in over 10 years. A Treasury Department report from May 2021 estimated that such an investment would enable the agency to hire roughly 87,000 employees by 2031. But most of those hires would not be Internal Revenue agents, and wouldn’t be new positions.

According to a Treasury Department official, the funds would cover a wide range of positions including IT technicians and taxpayer services support staff, as well as experienced auditors who would be largely tasked with cracking down on corporate and high-income tax evaders.

“It is wholly inaccurate to describe any of these resources as being about increasing audit scrutiny of the middle class or small businesses,” Natasha Sarin, a counselor for tax policy and implementation at the Treasury Department, tells TIME.

At the same time, more than half of the agency’s current employees are eligible for retirement and are expected to leave the agency within the next five years. “There’s a big wave of attrition that’s coming and a lot of these resources are just about filling those positions,” says Sarin, an economist who has studied tax avoidance extensively and who was tapped by the Biden administration to beef up the IRS’s auditing power.

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u/taws34 Sep 22 '22

"shrink the influence of the government"

Nixon, a Republican, created the EPA.

W.Bush created the Department of Homeland Security.

The only part of the government that Republicans want to shrink are the social programs that benefit citizens.

Otherwise, they are more than happy to increase funding for the police and military.

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u/Ok_Contribution_8817 Sep 22 '22

And let’s not forget that the Federal Government actually grew by 49% under Ronald Reagan

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u/tturedditor Sep 22 '22

As others have mentioned, they do NOT want to shrink the government. They want to use the government to force their religion on the entire population (abortion ban, books being banned, same sex marriage ban, prevent same sex couples from adopting, etc).

And their ideas to get rid of government agencies are downright ignorant.

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u/ibetthisistaken5190 Sep 22 '22 edited Sep 22 '22

shrink the influence of government

This is a cover. They want to selectively shrink it (e.g., financial regs), but they make it more than intrusive in other ways. Texas’ abortion laws immediately come to mind.

But that’s the point, right? These are no longer Republicans.

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u/homietheclown Sep 22 '22

A government so small it fits in your bedroom and your uterus.

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u/notbad2u Sep 22 '22

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservatism_in_the_United_States#:~:text=Conservatism%20in%20the%20United%20States%20is%20a%20political%20and%20social,in%20relation%20to%20U.S.%20states.

Exactly what you said. It's interesting to note that British Conservativism (aka Burkian) is pretty different -- Burke argued against revolution for instance -- but in effect American Conservativism could be seen as idealizing Monarchy.

9

u/ProfBunimo Sep 22 '22

Do people who want to shrink the government do things like propose abortion bans and try to limit who can marry who? Do they try to force libraries to ban books? Do they try to steal elections?

2

u/PerfectZeong Sep 22 '22

What party is the party of small government? It's not Republicans. It's not Democrats either but its certainly not Republicans.

5

u/flentaldoss Sep 22 '22

I never understood how the group that wants to shrink the influence of govt in economic distribution, but increase its control of individuals' lifestyle choices, disband entire governmental social services while increasing power and funding of enforcement agencies, and ensure that the civilian population are armed to the teeth against a possible tyrannical democratic turn by the govt minorities becoming the plurality, could possibly be facist

3

u/Juggz666 Sep 22 '22

Yeah the group that appointed judges to strike down super-precedent so certain red states can regulate vaginas at the cost of women's health cant be fascist whatsoever./s

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u/Mino_Swin Sep 22 '22

Because they only want to reduce the "size" of the government, not the actual force it controls. This simply takes the same amount of power and concentrates it into a smaller number of hands. No conservative politician seeks to reduce the number of police or soldiers at the government's command, merely the oversight apparatus that governs their use and conduct. When government agencies are disbanded in this context, their influence is not returned to a democratic electorate, but to "government contracting" corporations that seek to run the necessary functions of society for personal enrichment rather than the public good. The privatization of social utilities means that these organizations are no longer accountable to the democratic electorate, merely to the pursuit and extraction of profit by any means.

As to the society being armed to the teeth, this actually does little to guarantee freedom. Authoritarian politicians understand that they can count on a large number of armed ideological groups to function as non-state paramilitaries, who support police and military forces, and intimidate political opposition, while granting plausible deniability to politicians when they are used. They also understand that when left wing groups conduct any similar activities, they can be directly confronted by armed right wing reactionaries who are often tacitly or openly supported by police and national guard forces.

2

u/Y_signal2020 Sep 22 '22

small government

laughs in

War in Drugs War on Terror Blue Lives Matter

2

u/Asclepius333 Sep 22 '22

That's because they aren't the party of "small government." Maybe they were at one time, but current American Conservative ideology is only functional when a hierarchy is established, implemented, and preserved via our laws and the "culture wars" that they're always on about. In this country, that hierarchy is both race and class based, with an ENORMOUS overlap between the two because it was set up that way.

The guy in this video may be sincere in his hatred for the KKK, but voting for the current Republican party as it stands today means voting for people who agree with the KKKs sentiments. I would say that Republican/Nat-C politicians are more discrete with their racism than the KKK, but every day that proves less and less true.

2

u/_BeerAndCheese_ Sep 22 '22 edited Sep 22 '22

that wants to shrink the influence of govt, disband entire governmental agencies

Only in ways that benefit the majority and harm the vulnerable. Increasing military spending, increasing police funding (and blindly supporting them ESPECIALLY when they are beating civilians in the streets), expanding the prison system, building a giant border wall, caging immigrants, trafficking LEGAL migrants, banning and burning books, forcing schools to teach based on their ideologies, openly working to force their religion on everyone else, dictating who and who cannot be married, and let's not forget forcing women to have children (against the majority's will). These all directly fly in the face of "shrinking gov influence", doesn't it? But hey, they're defunding schools in poor neighborhoods, so only the rich get to go to private schools with vouchers. Seriously, never in my lifetime has any conservative been in favor of reducing government across the board. They pick and choose what they want to disband. Once you decide to think critically about what they disband and what they enforce, the answers become quite clear. I mean seriously, these are the people who push for capital punishment, the ultimate oppressive tool of a government. You don't get to claim you want to "shrink the influence of gov" when you at the same time push to make it legal for the government to KILL PEOPLE. Like what kind of duplicitous shit is that.

ensure that the civilian population are armed to the teeth

Governor Reagan, aka conservative jesus, enacted gun laws in California due to "uppity blacks". This wasn't that long ago. Trump banned bump stocks, against gun advocate wishes. And are you so sure they're the party that wants people armed? That number of people prosecuted for firearms continued to rise to 14,200 in 2020, btw. It looks to me that at least in my life time, every Republican president has seen a massive spike in federal firearm prosecutions, and every Democratic one has massive declines. To the point that Obama presidency saw nearly half as many as Bush Jr.

Fascism blames the ills of society on minority groups that exist within the society, and posits that the problems can be solved by reducing or exterminating the influence of those "outsiders". This fits Trumpism ideology to the T. Those groups are un-American; the reason you are not well off is because those immigrants keep taking jobs, those minorities have affirmative action, those gay people are getting married, those communists are attacking Christmas. These are all regular talking points.

2

u/dstar09 Sep 22 '22

Hate to break it to you, but Trump, after he found out he lost in 2020, wanted to deploy the military to overturn the results of the presidential election! See https://www.forbes.com/sites/nicholasreimann/2020/12/19/trump-reportedly-asked-advisors-about-deploying-military-to-overturn-election/?sh=5e8bfacace2b Trump also had a surprising number of military generals as part of his cabinet/staff, more than any president since Ulysses Grant. Trump told one general in his staff that he wished HIS generals in his staff were more loyal like to him like the generals in Nazi Germany under Hitler! He also wanted to have a military parade just like the fascist dictators have to display military strength to everyone. I could give you many more examples of Trump’s tendencies towards fascism if you want. Here’s a link for the last one: https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2022/08/15/inside-the-war-between-trump-and-his-generals

1

u/reddit4getit Sep 22 '22

Because these people don't know what fascism is.

They think fascism is sending a "mean" tweet.

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u/[deleted] Sep 22 '22

[deleted]

2

u/PirateJazz Sep 22 '22

YOU'RE THE ONE USING BIG WORDS! <WHY?

ALSO! Fascism is an appropriate name for an administration that usurps power through unscrupulous means (gerrymandering, propaganda, election fraud, an attempted coup...) and uses that power to subjugate our citizens, diminishing or outright eliminating our rights.

Ask yourself, if the Republicans really want a small government, why are they constantly trying to pass legislation that gives the government more control over our personal lives?

-1

u/reddit4getit Sep 22 '22

There was no policy or action under the Trump administration that resembles anything that looks like fascism

Unless he tried to force you to take a vaccine, then maybe you could start there.

1

u/LukesRightHandMan Sep 22 '22

Dude, his very first legislative action was the "Muslim ban."

2

u/reddit4getit Sep 22 '22

There wasn't a ban on Muslims though.

The actual ban was for specific countries originally set by Obama, which forbid citizens from these countries from entering the US for a number of reasons.

Muslims from any other country were welcome to legally migrate to the US.

1

u/turinturambar81 Sep 22 '22

Making Sidney Powell a special counsel in December 2020 with the authority to seize voting machines, at the very least, qualifies.

2

u/reddit4getit Sep 22 '22

Quick Google...

But all versions included language that would have allowed Trump to appoint a special counsel to investigate claims of foreign interference in the 2020 election,

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/feb/04/trump-draft-order-voting-machines-white-house-meeting

That isn't fascism, thats following protocol to begin an investigation.

President Trump never followed through with this anyhow.

2

u/turinturambar81 Sep 22 '22

I'm not talking about appointing a Special Counsel alone, of which there were already 2 during his administration (Mueller and Durham). I'm talking about that he was doing so with his own lawyer, and that her plan was to seize voting machines, which is not a power held by the Federal Government. https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/2022/08/15/sidney-powell-coffee-county-sullivan-strickler/

He already had his cronies handling them inappropriately in at least GA. https://thehill.com/policy/national-security/3651657-footage-shows-trump-allies-handling-georgia-voting-equipment/

0

u/reddit4getit Sep 22 '22

I'm talking about that he was doing so with his own lawyer, and that her plan was to seize voting machines,

Yes, the plan was to appoint her as the special counsel and use emergency presidential powers to seize the machines as part of an investigation.

I posted the link above that explains this, you didn't read it.

Mueller had already retired and Durham was running another investigation.

And who cares though?

He didn't go through with this plan.

2

u/turinturambar81 Sep 22 '22

He tried. No one took him seriously. He told Cipillone she was special counsel, he had the power to do it, and Cipillone ignored him. His lack of success in this endeavor doesn't make it any less fascist.

1

u/Conrexxthor Sep 22 '22

Funniest part to me is that the KKK also support Trump, so this guy is like "You racist fascists make us regularly intolerant fascists look bad!"

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u/CertifiedBSC Sep 22 '22

And that red outfit isn’t helping

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u/msweigart Sep 22 '22

“You guys are so much more racist you take it too far. “

1

u/kai-ol Sep 22 '22

Bingo! He doesn't hate the KKK, he hates that his views and actions automatically align him with the much-hated racist, violent group, which makes it very difficult for him to ever be right.

1

u/RedditingMyLifeAway Sep 23 '22

This is the correct take.

1

u/MenShouldntHaveCats Sep 23 '22

Idk I only see one side sending their brown shirts to shutdown speech at universities and using the DOJ to intimidate political opponents

1

u/RuthlessIndecision Sep 23 '22

Misdirection has its limits I guess